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Tripping from Apiol?

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toastus

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May 8 08 10:24 PM

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If you have to isolate Myristicin from parsley seed oil and get rid of the apiol, then shouldn't regular parsley seed oil be high in apiol?

It should be possible to use this. It looks like a fusion of the 2C-x compounds and MDPEA.

Of course, many inhibitors must be tested with it to find out just what activates it. What I'm concerned about is how dangerous apiol is supposed to be. If someone is trying to figure out how to activate it, and they don't succeed, wouldn't that amount of apiol be toxic?

Is there any way to predict what will activate it?

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69ron

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May 10 08 6:52 PM

Keep in mind that there is dill-apiol as well as parsley apiol (sometimes called parsley camphor). They are not the same.

Surprisingly, parsley seed oil is used in pretty high doses therapeutically. Dosage is 5 – 15 drops (0.2 - 0.6 ml). That’s enough for me to get psychedelic effects from it, however I use the variety that’s high in myristicin, which isn’t as toxic. Still, I am surprised people don’t complain about it’s psychedelic effects in such doses.

There are basically two kinds of parsley seed oil. One kind is high in myristicin, about 50%, with almost no apiol. The other is high in apoil with very little myristicin. The curly leaf variety is the kind high in myristicin.

Supposedly, apiol can be freeze precipitated out of the oil if it’s the kind high in apiol. The melting point is only 26-55 C. Myristicin cannot be freeze precipitated because it does not form crystals.

I suspect using the same inhibitors that work for myristicin would be good for apiol. It’s structure is very similar. In other words a strong CYP1A2 inhibitor and a strong CYP3A4 inhibitor should do the trick. German chamomile (5-10 grams of herb or about 3-8 drops of the oil) and white grapefruit juice (2 cups) should work if taken about 20-40 minutes before taking apiol.

As far as it’s toxicity, it’s probably mostly toxic if not converted to a psychedelic, but that’s just a guess.

Parlsey apoil is 4 times more toxic than myristicin. The LD50 for parsley apiol intravenously is 50 mg/kg in mice, for myristicin it’s 200 mg/kg intravenously. Of course the oral LD50 is much higher for both of these. I don’t know the oral LD50 for apiol, but for mysiticin it is 4260 mg/kg orally in rats.


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toastus

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May 10 08 10:21 PM

Wow, putting it in the fridge will crystallize it? So you could get pure apiol crystals, pour off the rest of the liquid, then melt it back into oil and use it?

Here are some resources for the amphetamine version of apiole and dillapiole:
http://pihkal.info/essentialOils.php?domain=pk
http://pihkal.info/read.php?domain=pk&id=58
http://pihkal.info/read.php?domain=pk&id=59
The apiole analogue is active, dillapioles analogue is supposedly active.

Apiol would be the one of the few natural 2C-x compounds, lol

Also, I've been trying to find the right inhibitors for myristicin. I remember seeing the correct inhibitors before, but I couldn't find them when I went looking for them. So the right inhibitors for myristicin and (theoretically) apiol are German Chamomile and White Grapefruit Juice?

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maggy

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May 11 08 12:08 AM

I read you need to put it in the freezer overnight and apiol will crystallize out.
 
Apiol has some medicinal value. You might find the following information useful:
 
 
Apiol, as found in commerce, is usually prepared by extracting the bruised fresh fruits of parsley, Carum Petroselinum (Benth. et Hook.), (N.O. Umbelliferae), with ether, and distilling off the solvent. The residue is commercial liquid apiol, a green, non-viscous, oily liquid (specific gravity, 1.095 to 1.107), from which yellow apiol (specific gravity, 1.125) can be prepared by the removal of fatty and waxy substances. Liquid apiol has a peculiar odour and a disagreeable, acrid taste. So-called crystallised apiol or parsley camphor may be obtained from the volatile oil by cooling to a low temperature. In oil from German fruit it is present in such abundance as to render the oil semi-solid at ordinary temperatures (see Oleum Petroselini). It occurs in the form of white acicular crystals, having the formula C12H14O4. It has a slight parsley-like odour and an aromatic burning taste. Insoluble, or only very slightly soluble, in water; readily soluble in alcohol, ether, and oils. Melting-point, 30°; boiling-point, 294°. Not easily volatilised in aqueous vapour. It dissolves in strong sulphuric acid with a characteristic blood-red colour. Treatment with potassium permanganate yields apiolic acid (C10H10O6), melting-point, 175°. Boiling alcoholic solution of potassium hydroxide converts true apiol into an isomeric substance, isoapiol, melting at 55° to 56°, and boiling at 304°. The dose of crystallised apiol is from 2 to 3 decigrams (3 to 5 grains). Another apiol is that obtained from oil of Indian dill (Peucedanum Sowa, Kurz.), (N.O. Umbelliferae), and known as dill-apiol. It is an oily liquid, not crystallisable, boiling at 285° with slight decomposition. It has the same composition as that obtained from parsley-viz., C12H14O4, and yields crystalline dill-isoapiol when heated with sodium ethylate; dill-isoapiol melts at 44° and boils at 296°. Apiolin (white apioline) is prepared from yellow apiol by eliminating all traces of fats and wax, and represents the purest form of liquid apiol. Specific gravity, 1.124 to 1.135.
 
Action and Uses.—Liquid apiol has an action like that of essential oils generally. It is chiefly used in dysmenorrhoea and amenorrhoea, and, no doubt, acts by local reflex irritation during excretion by the urinary tract; it is also a diuretic. In large doses apiol sometimes produces effects like those of cinchonism, such as ringing in the ears, headache, and vertigo, and was at one time employed as an antiperiodic in ague. It is usually administered in capsules or perles.

Dose.—2 to 6 decimils (0.2 to 0.6 milliliters) (3 to 10 minims).

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69ron

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May 11 08 6:16 AM

Wow, putting it in the fridge will crystallize it? So you could get pure apiol crystals, pour off the rest of the liquid, then melt it back into oil and use it?

-toastus

Yes. That’s what I read. I don’t have oil high in apiol though, so I haven’t seen it in action. I have the kind high in myristicin. I tried it with that oil and nothing precipitated out after being in the freezer for 1 week. With the other variety of parsley oil it should form crystals if you leave it in the freezer overnight.

The apiol crystals are solid at room temperature when pure. They will easily dissolve if added to oil. They are purified by dissolving in clean vegetable oil and freeze precipitated out.

Also, I've been trying to find the right inhibitors for myristicin. I remember seeing the correct inhibitors before, but I couldn't find them when I went looking for them. So the right inhibitors for myristicin and (theoretically) apiol are German Chamomile and White Grapefruit Juice?

-toastus

Yes. Myristicin is primarily attacked by CYP1A2 and CYP3A4. This is well documented. You could use German chamomile for the CYP1A2 inhibition, and then something like pure quercetin (this is highly recommended), or white grapefruice juice, or black pepper to inhibit CYP3A4. Quercetin can be purchased in pure form OTC. Use about 250 mg in a capsule to potently inhibit CYP3A4. It’s much better than using black pepper or white grapejuice because the dosage can be measure out exactly.

This inhibitor information applies to myristicin, safrole, and should apply to apiol, but NOT elemicin, because these CYP3A4 inhibitors also inhibit CYP2D6 which seems to be very bad for elemicin. I will test quercetin with elemicin to verify that soon, but the others are definitely bad for elemicin, but not myristicin, safrole, etc.

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hendrix

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Sep 21 08 4:27 AM

In looking for oil that’s high in apiole, I came across a lot of dead ends. The flat leaf variety is the only one that’s high in apiole, and I can’t find it anywhere.

Parsley seed oil from Germany is the flat leaf variety which is high in apiole. This is impossible to buy. I tried finding it.

Is there another country that produces parsley seed oil that’s actually high in apiole?

As the text above posted by Maggy states, oil high in apiole is thick, and semi solid. It eventually solidifies. So oil that’s high in apiole will either be solid or very thick.

Is there a parsley seed oil that you can actually buy that’s high in apiole that’s not from Germany? Is German oil the only oil that’s high in apiole? I don’t mind getting solid or thick oil. I can always heat it a little to melt the apiole. But I can see this being a problem for a lot of buyers wanting the oil for aromatherapy purposes.

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hendrix

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Oct 3 08 4:48 AM

If someone has a source for a vendor of Parsley Seed Oil CT Apiole can you please post a "Vendors: Parsley Seed Oil CT Apiole" thread containing the source in this forum category. (Please follow the new forum rules on vendor listings). We already have a source for Parsley Seed Oil CT Myristicin.

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Oct 5 08 5:59 AM

What could be done with bulk organic flat leaf parsley seed ... 30bucks/lb? 
 
Most of the flat leaf seeds I'm looking at read "Italian".  Dunno if that means anything.
 
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hendrix

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Oct 20 08 7:35 AM

I talked to a guy who distills essential oils for a living who has tried distilling parsley seed oil that's got a shit load of apiole in it. He tried many times and then he gave up. This guy is a professional and he gave up. That says a lot. He said the reason he gave up is because every time he's tried it, the distillate it produces is an emulsion. He let the emulsion sit for days. Tried adding salt to it. Nothing helps break the emulsion. Eventually the water oil mix sort of settles down, but it never forms 2 layers. You end up with a bunch of bubbles of parsley seed oil floating in the water.

I asked him if apiole forms crystals after a while as the oil and water sits. He said it just sits there in the water as bubbles and never forms crystals. He says the only way to remove the essential oil from the water is to use toxic solvents like dichloromethane. He says his customers will not buy oil that’s extracted using toxic solvents so he gave up on it.

I know I wouldn’t buy essential oil that was extracted using anything other than water. The idea of ingesting dichloromethane is not attractive to me at all.

He said the only viable healthy option would be CO2 extraction of parsley seeds, and he’s not equipped for that. So he gave up on it. He does sell regular parsley seed oil because it doesn’t have this problem.

This explains why you never see parsley seed oil that’s high in apiole. What a bummer.

I looked into this a little. Apiole’s melting point and molecular weight are the key problems. It melts at room temperature, so when you steam distill apiole, the droplets that collect in the distillate are thick, almost frozen, so they don’t easily form a second layer. They will just sort of stay as little blobs. The other problem is that apiole is heavier than water, while a lot of the other components in the oil are lighter than water. This heaver than water and lighter than water mix of oils helps cause emulsions to form.

It looks like he was right. The only way to extract parsley seed oil that’s high in apiole is to use CO2 extraction, or some other solvent extraction. Steam distillation won’t work on it’s own. That really sucks.

Between the eyes and ears there lie The sounds of colour and the light of a sigh

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#10 [url]

Feb 17 10 8:18 PM

Apiol is a stimulant. Its not psychedelic. I got parley seed oil high in apiol many times. All it does is make you stimulated. Lots on anxiety too. Not fun at high doses. A tiny bit is a cool stimulant.

I got parlsey seed oil high in myristicin and that was very psychedelic. This is hard to get. Most places have the other kind.

Why is apiol not psychedelic?

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69ron

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Feb 17 10 9:11 PM



Note that parsley seed oil and apiole are both documented as being stimulants. No case of psychedelic effects are documented after oral ingestion of apiole in man, only stimulant effects. So maybe it actually has no psychedelic potential. But these tests didn't use oilahuasca activation tricks.

Parsley seed oil also had a bit of tetramethoxyallylbenzene, which might also be psychedelic if activated.

It's a very common misconception that parsley seed oil contains a lot of myristicin. Only a few hard to find varieties of parsley seed oil actually have much myristicin despite claims to the contrary. I know this is the case because I know the effects of myristicin very well now (after purchasing it in pure form). Most parsley seed oil doesn't give you a myristicin based trip. Its mostly just stimulating and mildly psychedelic.

I agree about apiole probably causing anxiety and being a potent stimulant. I do get some psychedelic effects from normal parsley seed oil, but they are mild compared to things like methyl chavicol, methyl eugenol, myristicin, etc. I must admit that I have never tried pure apiole. I am judging apiole by using oil that is high in apiole, not by using pure apiole. This is not very scientific, I know, but that's all I have to go by. Maybe the mild psychedelic effects I am getting are from the myristicin present in regular parsley seed oil high in apiole, and are not actually caused by the apiole.

I don't really like apiole all that much either. Parsley seed oil CT myristicin is really good, very close to the effects of pure myristicin. That's way more psychedelic than regular parsley seed oil, which at small doses is just a stimulant for me.

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